Dutchess County/Putnam County AT Management Committee
New York-New Jersey Trail Conference
Minutes of 166th Meeting
Monday, October 15, 2001 7:00 PM East Fishkill Library

Attendance: Ron Rosen, Walt Daniels, Jane Geisler, Jim Haggett, Frank Dogil, Gerry Richardson, Mike Arthur, Salley Decker (8).

We discussed possible projects that could be proposed for such funding and the potential approach to submitting such a proposal. Suggestions included (a) a survey of the 800 acre DEC parcel at Penny Road [perhaps with Greenway involvement]; (b) the formerly active farms along West Dover Road, with the possible involvement of Dutchess Land Conservancy, Oblong Land Conservancy, American Farmland Trust, and similar organizations; (c) lands adjacent to Kiyiwana farm (Hosner Mountain Road) that can be seen from the new southeasterly view from Hosner Mountain; and possibly lands in the viewshed of the viewpoints on Depot Hill; (d) depending on the outcome of the DEC's plans, the Camp Siwanoy property in the Town of Dover.

Ron commented that we need to identify volunteers willing to drive the process. Walt has provided Ron with a list of NYNJTC members who live in Dutchess County that can be used for recruiting volunteers for this project.

3. Other business, short updates, etc.:

A. Acquisitions and Survey update

Parcel opposite Nuclear Lake Entrance: There is a 5.5 acre parcel that Dutchess County acquired through non-payment of taxes. We had been asked earlier this year to consider this parcel for possible addition to the AT acquisition program, and at that time we decided that the parcel was not important enough to spend NPS acquisition funds on it. The Oblong Land Conservancy has taken an interest in this parcel, based primarily on the potential ill effects that bad management of the parcel would have on the designated scenic roads (Route 55 and Old Route 55). Recently (in the last week?) they decided to acquire it from Dutchess County (just prior to the tax parcel auction, so it has been removed from the auction list). Oblong would like to NOT hold the ownership of this parcel, and they would prefer that either NPS or the ATC Land Trust accept title from them. Pam Underhill indicated that NPS would consider accepting the parcel, although Don Owen was not as encouraging last Friday. Ron also discussed the parcel with Bob Williams (ATC Land Trust). The Land Trust indicated that they prefer that donations of land be accompanied with a fund for three purposes: an initial baseline condition survey, ongoing property monitoring, and long term incursion protection. Oblong plans to provide the baseline survey, and it seems reasonable to assign monitoring to the Nuclear Lake Caretaker as part of the caretaker agreement currently being developed by NPS, ATC, and our committee. There is no history of dumping or similar incursions on this parcel, so long-term management should not be difficulty. The Committee feels that either NPS or ATC/LT acceptance of the ownership of this parcel would be reasonable and we endorse either option. We should ask Oblong to contact the Land Trust to determine their requirements/specifications for the baseline survey so the survey that Oblong plans to perform will be acceptable for the ATC/LT's needs.

B. DOT project (Miller Hill Road/Taconic Parkway intersection) update : Jim Haggett indicated that he has heard nothing new from DOT, nor has any work been done on re-doing the AT treadway from the road to the bridge.

C. Bulletin Board inventory and review update: At the last meeting we decided to not rehab the existing bulletin boards, but rather to redesign the boards and build new ones [excluding three existing boards that belong to others and are indicated in the list that follows], but to have fewer boards. We made a list of up to ten sites:

1. Just off Route 9D near the Bear Mountain Bridge;
2. Possibly one at Graymoor, near the "Red Shed"
3. [existing Fahnestock State Park board on Dennytown Road]
4. 1 or 2 near Route 301/Canopus Lake [Walt Daniels will check with Bill Bauman]
5. RPH Shelter
6. Route 52, vicinity of parking lot or side trail to the lot
7. Depot Hill State Forest, vicinity of DEC parking lot
8. Route 55/Nuclear Lake at junction of the AT with Blue Trail to the parking area
9. West Dover Road near the Dover Oak Tree
10. [existing Metro North bulletin board at the AT Train Station at Route 22]
11. [existing Pawling Nature Reserve bulletin board where the AT enters their property]
12. Possibly one at Hoyt Road [Salley will check with CT/AMC to get their opinion]

Total 8-10 new boards.

D. Cell tower update: Jim Haggett indicated he has heard nothing new from ATC nor the cellular company.

E. Additional Water Testing problems: As circulated in the FYI collection, Sara Ohliger's water testing on 8/16 encountered a positive fecal coliform at the Morgan Stewart well on Depot Hill. The 9/26 retesting was done, requesting a quantitative reading, with a result of 1 colony per 100ml of water-a minimal positive result; however, RPH tested positive [total coliform only] on the 9/26 testing, and it will be retested quantitatively. Possible alternatives include shock chlorination of the Morgan Stewart and RPH wells, depending on the October results. Jim Haggett noted we should keep after ATC to supply the money to rehab the RPH well (including replacement of the pump).

F. Telephone Line at Dover Oak Tree update: Verizon appears to be cooperating with us to avoid damage to the crown of the Dover Oak tree. Ron met in the field with three Verizon employees (engineering, design, and construction interests). The designer originally hoped to move the new line underground on the west shoulder of the road, but the steep drop-off would make this option difficult and expensive. The most attractive option involves moving three of the new poles to the existing NYSEG/Verizon right of way that runs about 25' west of the road shoulder. This option will require that Verizon have an access point for vehicles to the ROW for installation and upkeep of the line. A likely location for an access point and gate was identified (well north of the AT near the Hasler driveways). We will recommend this option to the NPS and urge their cooperation with this route and the access requirements in order to avoid any threat to the Dover Oak.

During this discussion, Walt Daniels mentioned that he has been monitoring the DEC's notification newsletter and discovered an application for a buried communications line along the shoulder of Route 22 in (among other locations) Pawling. Walt surmised that there would probably be no problem if they plan to build in the DOT Right-of-way, but we should monitor the proposal, and make sure that installation does not result in an interruption of the Trail's use.

G. No Hunting Sign installation: In August, YRDC obtained the "No Hunting" signs that meet the requirements of NY Posting laws. The Public Lands Corps crew has installed some of the signs, but they have not informed us what they have completed. However, changes at YRDC (the PLC/Americorps crew assistant leader has left, and Alyssa Silberstein has been promoted to a training position at YRDC so she is no longer full-time leader for the PLC crew program) make it unlikely that they can do much more sign installation this year. Supervisors expressed interest in doing some sign installation themselves; Ron asked the supervisors to let him know how many signs they need and he will try to get the signs to them ASAP.

H. Hunting Season plans and sign distribution: Ron handed out the "annual" temporary signs for the supervisors to post at the Trail access points, and copies of the Press Release as well. Ron will soon send copies of the press release to most local newspapers.

I. Fred Gerty's Routed signs for Road Crossings: Since Fred could not be present tonight, he gave Ron a sample of formats he could use to rout signs that we can post at road intersections (to inform hikers the name of the road they are crossing). The Committee recommended the use of the smaller type size, and to consider using a v-groove router bit to make painting easier. The Committee prefers vertical orientation (portrait shape) to reduce the probability of vandalism and sign theft. Jim Haggett has some spare cedar that Fred can use. We suggested that Fred use brown stain and white paint for the letters. It was suggested that Fred also prepare similar signs to identify the shelter access trails (Morgan Stewart Shelter, Telephone Pioneers Shelter, and Shenandoah Group Campsite) and the sites on the trail (Wiley Shelter and perhaps Hemlock Springs campsite).

J. No one had any comments on the issue papers for the Mid-Atlantic Regional Meeting.

K. Gerry Richardson inquired about our ability to provide a program for his Youth program that he is organizing for August 1-3, 2002. It was suggested that NYNJTC can provide a display and that the Committee can provide a speaker and/or demonstrations if requested. These would occur on August 1 or 2 at VanWyck Junior High School on Route 376 in Fishkill Plains.

2. Reports

1. Area Supervisors Summaries:

1. Jane Geisler reported that Bob Woodin has been encountering multiple ATVs at Wiley Shelter, including an incident with 5 of them on September 30; Bob has a new (to him) car-a 94 Buick Century. She will be attending the Pawling Nature Reserve's meeting on October 26th.

2. Frank Dogil reported that he has been tracking ATV problems from Johnson Road to the Gate of Heaven Cemetery (where they use the dirt road from the Hospital for primary access). He circulated a color map of his research to date showing the routes he has mapped. One trail goes directly to the back of a house on Johnson Road just north of the Brown parcel. Walt suggested that Frank talk to Larry Wheelock about the recent NJ sting operation. Ron will see if we have any ATC/NPS "Yellow Meanie" signs that Frank could post at the corridor boundary. Frank will try to identify the homeowner and plans to follow-through.

3. Mike Arthur reported that he has inspected the Scout project results at the Telephone Pioneers shelter. They moved the fireplace and installed a front gutter on the shelter. The work was OK, but not great. They didn't take the opportunity to fabricate a new fireplace, and it certainly doesn't look "new." They also built new overflow sites. Mike suggested that Fred Gerty might also prepare routed signs to identify the individual tent sites.

4. Jim Haggett met with Alyssa Silberstein of YRDC. Her fall crew can only work for three hours per day (including travel), and therefore needs projects near road access. They will work on the parking access side trail from Route 55 to the AT at Nuclear Lake. They may also do some sidehilling near the area the Crew worked on three years ago. Blowdown removal north of Penny Road was suggested, but the trees are too big for her crew (can't use power equipment). We discussed the possibility of YRDC being considered as an ongoing trail maintaining organization. There are potential problems with this idea. Ron will talk with Chris Marx at YRDC to see if the idea has any merit. Jim also reported that a big American flag has been painted on the rocks at the summit of Shenandoah Mountain (in the aftermath of the September 11th incident) as a "memorial" by some unknown artist. The committee had mixed feelings about what should be done about this. It is clearly "unauthorized art" but it might be acceptable to leave it alone for the time being. We do not plan any immediate action. Jim has contacted Charlie Dennis to mow the I-84 overlook field this fall; Charlie agreed to do the work for $700. He still has not submitted a bill for doing the mowing three years ago. Jim has received word of a squatter that took up residence at the RPH site [in a tent] for 10 days. The police were called by a neighbor. Jim needs to get full information from the police, and he will also contact the neighbor. The RPH Privy is nearly full. Jim didn't have any good location in mind to move it; it was suggested that Jim investigate the feasibility and cost of pumping the sewage out.

Jim also reported on his investigation of a boundary problem at Shenandoah Lake Estates, near Long Hill Road (where we had an earlier "false alarm" potential incursion. The recent NPS-contracted survey included a monument (273A-55A) that was seven feet from the development's cul-de-sac. Shortly after the monument was installed, it disappeared. Jim obtained a fax of a section of the new Hartman survey map, and located the monument's site but could not find it. He then rented a metal detector, and after great difficulty, located the monument totally buried in dirt 36 feet away. He has sent the information to Bob Gray who will pursue the incursion with the developer or his grading contractor.

5. Walt Daniels reported that the Old Mine Railbed trail has been closed, officially to "restore wildlife habitat." Walt also mentioned that the AMC is having its annual club-wide fall gathering at Graymoor next weekend, and plans to plant a commemorative tree on the AT corridor.

B. Other reports - Ron read Father Fred's Annual Report on Graymoor's assistance for the through hikers this season. Fred reported that 401 hikers were fed in the dining room during July and August, compared to 364 the previous year. Fred also reported that meals were brought down to the hikers at the ballfield shelter during April, May, and June. He noted an unusual percentage of female thru-hikers this year. At one meal, six of sixteen hikers present were female. The Friars assisted a number of sick or injured hikers with trips to the hospital or clinic; illnesses included Lyme disease, leg injuries, and upset stomachs.

Ron indicated that he received a call from Dan Chazin regarding the new AT Guide, seeking information from the supervisors. Dan plans to prepare the revision this winter. Walt indicated that the new guides are adopting a new format, including more educational material and only presenting the trail in one direction. Walt indicated that Dan's schedule may be tight, given the extent of the planned changes. In any event, supervisors (and others) can forward any changes or additional material of interest to Dan.

6. The meeting was adjourned at approximately 10:15 PM